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Interview(s):
Kozo Morishita
Translated & Interpreted by Jeremy Barlow © Soundwave's Oblivion
2024
Interview from Figure King 316 (May 2024)
Here is a message from Mr Ono, the legendary toy designer who worked on the
latest Masterpiece Skids.
The first
of our Transformers 40th Anniversary Interviews….The man who created the
Transformers cartoon series
Kozo Morishita
(Current Chairman and CEO of Toei Animation & Fight! Super Robot Lifeform
Transformers Director)
Here we interview Toei Animation's Chairman Kozo Morishita, a key figure in
the creation of the cartoon "Fight! Super Robot Lifeform Transformers" 40
years ago. Without the tireless efforts of the young Morishita, who worked
diligently across Japan and the United States, Transformers would not have
endured for four decades.
Back then, what collaborations were Toei Animation
(formerly Toei Doga) involved with?
Before "Transformers," they produced several films, including "The Pink
Panther" and "Spider-Man" (both in 1981). When they began working on
"Transformers," the exchange rate was about 240 yen to the dollar, which
allowed them to make a significant profit. The production cost for a
Japanese TV cartoon was around 8 million yen, but they received
approximately 26 million yen for their work. They made a lot of money
(laughs).
I heard that your interest in Transformers began
with a commercial for "GIJoe: The Earth's Strongest Expert Team?
A Marvel Comics employee based in Japan saw "Tiger Mask II," for which I was
the chief director, and approached me about the project. I don’t think it
was Gene Pelc. Pelc was the Marvel employee who served as the liaison for
the TV series.
Americans, accustomed only to traditional cartoons, were surprised by the
dynamic action scenes in the comic-style "Tiger Mask II." The foundation of
Japanese animation is to depict motion effectively with a small number of
frames. They were amazed that we could achieve this every week on a limited
budget. In 1983, we created a short commercial animation for the "GI Joe"
toys, animating the toys themselves. The United States was astonished by the
quality we achieved.
And that success led to "Transformers" the
following year.
Up until then, I had been directing episodes of "UFO Robot Grendizer" and
other shows. Just before that, I had been working as chief director on a
series of robot cartoons, including "Armored Fleet Dairugger XV," "Lightspeed
Electroid Albegas," and "Video Warrior Laserion," which led to my overseas
nickname, "Robot Morishita." Thanks to the success of "GI Joe," I received
invitations from Disney and Marvel to meet when I went to San Francisco and
Los Angeles on my honeymoon. When I visited, they asked, "How can you make a
cartoon like that?" and "Please stay in Los Angeles for a while" (laughs). I
turned down the offer to relocate, but I was able to take on many cartoon
projects afterward.
What was the production of Transformers like?
We outsourced the majority of the production work. The only in-house staff
involved were Yamauchi (Shigeyasu), Takayama (Hideki), and a few other
creators. Initially, the "storyboard" was sent from the US, but it differed
from the traditional Japanese storyboard. If we handed it over to the
animators as it was, they couldn't draw it properly. So, we re-cut it,
connected the cuts here, and remade it in Toei Animation's storyboard style.
When there were too many things to fix, we didn't just remake it; we rewrote
it from scratch (laughs). It turned out well that we adapted it to the
Japanese style in the end. We also outsourced the clean-up work for our
storyboards to a company in the Philippines. They were exceptionally good at
drawing.
The artwork was also outsourced to domestic
animation studios, such as Ashi Productions, correct?
That's right. Back then, it was the go-to place when you were in a bind.
While I did cultivate some domestic talent, I primarily commissioned Daewon
Video and other companies in Korea for the majority of the work.
I’ve heard that the restrictions on the number of
drawings were also quite relaxed back then?
We had the budget (laughs). We didn’t rely on banks for transformations.
What were your thoughts on the content of the
storyboard?
In Japanese robot anime, the story and sequence of events are meticulously
planned. For example, in "Mazinger Z," Mazinger Z emerges from the pool,
then combines with the Pilder, and later integrates with the Jet Scrander.
However, American staff might not think in such detailed terms; they might
simply add the Scrander as if it were a standard feature (laughs).
In a series like "Transformers," with its numerous robots, this approach
might surprisingly work well, maintaining a good story tempo. I regret that
in "Dairugger XV" the more the scriptwriter focused on the drama, the less
effectively the mecha elements were utilised. We had up to 15 mechas
combining into three teams, which then formed a single robot—probably the
highest number of combinations in a robot anime. Unfortunately, I wasn't
able to use this concept effectively in the story. But I’m maybe
overthinking this.
Did you notice any other differences between the
U.S. and Japan?
Above all, the role of an animation director differs significantly between
Japan and the U.S. In Japan, the director is deeply involved in directing
the production. In contrast, in the U.S., the director primarily writes
stage directions based on the script and notes the timing on the storyboard.
This difference is largely due to the strong influence of unions in the U.S.
Once the film is completed, it moves out of the animation director's hands
and into post-production (editing). In the U.S., it is crucial for various
people to share responsibilities while safeguarding their own roles. The
authority of the unions is a major difference compared to Japan.
It was a striking piece of work in the U.S., where
Japanese-style robot animation was not yet widely familiar.
American children probably never imagined that robots in cartoons could
transform and combine in such a realistic way. It was revolutionary to see
the robots they had watched on TV displayed for sale in toy stores.
The tremendous success of Transformers paved the
way for the development of a feature film.
The film wasn't properly released in Japan. Determined to create something
extraordinary, I decided to start by producing a pilot film.
The pilot team was composed mostly of young talent,
who came together in one room and worked tirelessly on the project.
The veteran staff had their own distinctive styles, so they intentionally
assembled a team of young talent. I recall that they brought together the
most promising trainees and young professionals—individuals who were at the
forefront of the industry at that time. Today, many of them have become
renowned animators. Their attention to detail and vibrant creativity was
truly remarkable.
One of the scenes created in the pilot featured
Unicron attacking the planet Lithone.
Everything was hand-drawn, right down to the smallest pieces of rubble—a
process that would be impossible today. This technique, used in
feature-length films by Toei in the past, involved a level of detail rarely
seen. I appointed Matoba (Shigeo) as the chief animator for that scene; he's
a veteran who had been working on feature films since the '60s. I recall
that the pilot film was previewed in a screening room at Warner Brothers or
a similar venue, and everyone involved was astonished. This was before CG,
and they were so impressed that they asked to see it again. I ended up
showing it about five times in a row (laughs).
I understand that all the animation settings were
revised by the Toei Doga team.
We did. The character sketches sent from the production team were all
redrawn by Tsunoda (Koichi), the animation director. I asked him to take on
the task because he had some free time in his schedule and was a diligent
worker. It was amazing to see how he added shadows to the enormous Unicron
and brought it to life through animation.
As an anime fan, I was thrilled to see the
involvement of Tsunoda-san, who was responsible for the renowned "Mazinger Z
vs. the Dark General."
Initially, when I presented the preliminary drawings to the American team,
they were not well-received. They criticised the colour specifications with
three-tiered shadows, saying the paint lines resembled tree rings and looked
like wood. After I explained that this was merely a technical specification
and that the final colouring would make it look like metal, they finally
understood. This experience highlighted a technical difference between us.
I believe you were aiming to make the image
stunning, including the shading.
One thing I remember clearly is using a lot of optical masks. I wanted it to
have a "Star Wars" feel, so I incorporated extensive optical compositing.
Toei Kagaku (now Toei Lab Tech) handled the complex opticals for us. They
dedicated a lot of time to difficult cuts, reworking them multiple times.
They did charge us for the extra effort, but fortunately, we had the budget
for it (laughs).
Yamauchi-san was amazed by the penetrating light
effects across the monitor and other screens created by Morishita-san.
I was quite impressed with their ingenious skills as I watched them work in
the studio at that time. They were the ones who were truly amazing.
Besides Unicron, were there any other memorable
scenes?
The underwater scenes created by Takayama retained the familiar underwater
imagery but were assembled by cutting and pasting together original drawings
that were not particularly impressive. He was also a remarkably talented
assistant director. After "The Movie," Yamauchi quickly brought him on board
for "Saint Seiya." Their popularity was such that they were even referred to
as "sensei" in Korea.
I believe that Kaname Productions handled the scene
where Hot Rod first appears.
They were a skilled studio, and the late Mutsumi Inomata was also a part of
their team. This studio also worked on "Albegas" and "Laserion."
What was your impression of Director Nelson Shin?
I got the impression that he functioned more as the CEO of AKOM Productions
in Korea than as a director. Nonetheless, his passion for animation
production was extraordinary. He often seemed to struggle balancing the
demands of Marvel Productions with those of the production staff. Despite
these challenges, he’s a genuinely nice person. I’ve kept in touch with him
ever since.
Was there anything else that impressed you?
Orson Welles, a renowned actor, voiced Unicron, and given that it was an
American film, both the music and voice acting were exceptional. In the US,
well-known actors often lend their talents to children's films when asked.
It is said that the budget was an unprecedented 4
billion yen at the time. Did you have any real sense of this scale while
working at the studio?
I don’t know the exact total, but the budget was so large that there was
some left over, leading to comments like, "Morishita isn't that great—can’t
you spend more?" For instance, I stayed in the United States for about six
months before production, and all expenses, including the interpreter’s
fees, hotel accommodation, meals, and even alcohol, were covered. When I
bought a bicycle to commute from the hotel to the office, they said, "We’ll
cover that too." I felt like I couldn’t spend money fast enough (laughs).
Consequently, when I worked on "Saint Seiya" right after "The Movie," I
invested a huge amount in the first episode and the opening sequence
(laughs). The company then warned me that if other directors followed suit,
it could become a problem, so I transitioned from directing to the planning
department.
Has your experience with “Transformers” influenced
your work since then?
Without “Transformers”, I don’t think “Saint Seiya” would have turned out as
it did. The experience gained from Transformers allowed me to direct “Saint
Seiya” with greater freedom, unshackled by the constraints of a "Shonen
Jump" manga. It also changed how budgets were allocated. This shift in
approach has influenced the industry as a whole and can be seen in newer
works like “Demon Slayer: Kimetsu no Yaiba”.
If you hadn't worked on the G.I. Joe commercial
back then, history might have unfolded differently. What are your thoughts
on the series as it celebrates its 40th anniversary this year?
It's really been 40 years….. In fact, my grandson is a fan of the
live-action “Transformers” movie. He might not believe it if I told him that
his grandpa worked on the original animation. I think he’d be quite
surprised to find out. Make sure you include a picture of me in this article
(laughs).
Fans of the TV series and *The Movie* remain
dedicated all over the world. There's even a toy line themed around *The
Movie* called the "86 Series."
I wish Toei Animation had arranged a royalty contract with us back then
(laughs). I’m not sure how the quality of “The Movie” holds up when I
rewatch it now, but it was all hand-drawn animation with no CG. I’d be
delighted if fans had the chance to experience it again someday.
(10th May 2024, at Toei Animation headquarters)
Kozo Morishita
Born on July 17, 1948, in Shizuoka Prefecture, he joined Toei Doga (now Toei
Animation) as an assistant director in 1970. He contributed to various
productions, beginning with “Kick Demon”. His directorial debut came with
Tiger Mask II, which caught the attention of Marvel Comics. Marvel,
collaborating with Hasbro on “G.I. Joe: The Strongest Expert Team on Earth”,
enlisted him to produce animation for the toy's commercial in 1983. This led
to his involvement in creating the commercial and main feature of “Fight!
Super Robot Lifeform Transformers” in 1984. During the same period, he
directed “Armored Fleet Dairugger XV”, “Lightspeed Electro-God Albegas”, and
“Video Warrior Laserion”, and launched “Saint Seiya” in 1986. In 1988, he
transitioned to the planning department and contributed as a planner to the
final stages of “Dragon Ball”. He continued his role as a planner through
“Dragon Ball Z” and up to “Dragon Ball Super”. He is currently the chairman
and representative director of Toei Animation.
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